Myriam-Olga - Made with Clipchamp
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[00:00:00] Olga: Hi everyone, long time no see. This SEO cash flow number, I'm not sure what number it is. This is a, a fun and special episode where we want to catch up with what's going on with our projects, with our work, and also talk about a little bit about SEO courses, communities, and how we do those things, how we approach them.
[00:00:24] Olga: So Miriam, how are you doing today? What are you up to?
[00:00:29] Myriam: Very good. So the French have this saying, Pas de nouvelle, bonne nouvelle. So no news, good news. Meaning that if you haven't heard from us, it's because we've been up to some things and, um, I, I would like to get started with what you've been up to because it really ties into our topic today.
[00:00:48] Olga: Okay.. So let me, let me share the news. So a month ago I finally revamped and relaunched my community called SEO Site Pro, which is like community of other SEOs and myself, where we discuss different topics around SEO. there are around, I think, 15, maybe 20 like thematic channels where we discuss things and a few other features.
[00:01:15] Olga: And this was like the introduction to a bigger thing, something that I started pre selling today, which is my long awaited course on SEO auditing, something I have been talking about and trying to launch for more than two years. So finally, I'm The presale started and the course will officially launch in August 1st, so it is like, it is coming, finally.
[00:01:42] Myriam: We, we have, we have to go back in time though, um, because there's something that you're not saying, Olga. Of the things is I travel a lot. So in my head, when you say it's been two years, I picture specific cities, specific things I was doing while waiting for you to launch your course in your community. So let me explain.
[00:02:04] Myriam: I was back in Canada when I first started, um, kind of, Getting not jealous, but like, Oh my God, there's this person doing all of these tutorials that I wish I had the time to make. Not only that, but they're made way better than I would have made them. So, you know, I started getting to know you through your work initially.
[00:02:23] Myriam: And that was with heavy winters that go down to minus 43 degrees Celsius. But yeah, I know it's been that long, but I remember us talking about, you know, you launching a course for much longer than this. And I remember I was in Budapest when we discussed this because you had to set back, you already wanted to launch this.
[00:02:46] Myriam: And then, you know, there was a bit of a scandal, someone got in your way and it was not pretty. And here you are, you know, recovering from this and fast forward, I'm in Italy when you're like, Nana, I'm not going to let this get me down. Like, I know my work is good. So good that people want to emulate it to say something nice.
[00:03:06] Myriam: And you're like, okay. Let me go back to square one. Like I know that I can do this in a way where my work doesn't get taken for granted and it still brings the same value. And I remember that cause I was in Southern Italy when this happened and I was excited. And now I'm in Berlin hearing all about the launch.
[00:03:27] Myriam: So there's this, I have like a world map of Olga is finally going to launch the course and the community and I'm excited to hear about it.
[00:03:37] Olga: Yeah. I really like how you associate the things I do with where you were at the time. That's, that's fascinating, really.
[00:03:46] Olga: So yeah, please go ahead.
[00:03:48] Myriam: It's been a, it's been a long time coming and it's one of those things where, you know, Let's be honest here. When we're talking about courses, everyone and their mother had courses during the pandemic. There was a huge boom. Everybody wanted to get trained. And now, money is getting tighter.
[00:04:08] Myriam: People are getting angrier. You see a lot of Googley sides of humanity. And here you are relaunching it, because you've got something going on that most of the courses during the pandemic didn't quite clinch. So I'm gonna let you just dive into, you know, hey, how did you think about this? How did you build it?
[00:04:30] Myriam: And who is it for?
[00:04:32] Olga: Yeah, sure. So, the course is called SEO Audit Mastery it is going to be one huge course that I will be updating and working on over time.
[00:04:43] Olga: At the launch, it is going to have around 25 maybe 30 videos and a bunch of modules, but those will be extended and updated on a weekly basis. So, that's why at starters the price is very low and it will keep increasing together with me adding new content. this course will teach people my entire SEO audit.
[00:05:05] Olga: process, like it is the course all about all things as you're auditing from start to finish with a lot of at first theoretical philosophical even videos. And then with a lot of like practical stuff, where I am like showing exactly how to do something, what tool to use, a lot of considerations.
[00:05:24] Olga: So it is both for beginners. who want to like learn doing auditing the right way from day one. And it is also for advanced people who want to , systemize their knowledge, want to fill in any gaps and want to learn the approach that has been very successful for me, very effective for my clients.
[00:05:47] Olga: And that has been giving me a lot of motivation, a lot of satisfaction simply. So a deep dive. I hope the deepest, the most comprehensive into SEO auditing that is available and it is based on my 12 years of experience in SEO, seven years of which I have been doing nothing other than audits.
[00:06:10] Olga: So, this is a wild and deep dive into SEO audits in a nutshell.
[00:06:19] Myriam: I have opinions. I have opinions because I have a diploma in sociology, and I don't know if I already said that or not, but communities really interest. The way we learn, like I'm a certified trainer, and the way we learn as humans, it's not linear.
[00:06:35] Myriam: So everybody thinks, oh, I'm going to be visual, or I need audio, or I need video, or I need to move. No, we process information in different contexts. At different rates, but also in different ways and the thing that I like about what you describe is that you know That you don't know everything and most SEOs feel that way and I loved when you said There's an there's a beginning and there's an end to this because when we do audits we're like, where do I stop?
[00:07:06] Myriam: Did I do this? I have this this like unusual problem. I'm gonna waste half a day on I don't know if it's right that I spend that much time on it These are all the questions that you handle because you've been there but not only that You've been in contact with a lot of people that you have trained over the years.
[00:07:22] Myriam: So that's where that sense of community comes in is that you get the feedback from your community, but also getting one of these courses, it's not just the course, it's the entire network that comes with it. It's the community that you can exchange with, which to me. Is the return on investment that I will get out of really expensive events, for example, and that event, it's kind of a one and done.
[00:07:50] Myriam: It's not a safe place that you can go back to and ask questions. And most of us. We, we know how to do SEO up until there's like this brand new problem that happens and you're like, how do I stop that? Yeah. Oh my God. Like lately, what most of us, if you're into image SEO, like everyone gets asked this one question, why do I have the crawl, but not indexed, but it's just like web P yeah.
[00:08:19] Myriam: Okay. You see exactly what I'm talking about. We did not talk about this beforehand, but I know, you know, and that's the thing. You're like, oh, I don't have time to look into this right now, but I kind of wish I had the answer, but I can't justify spending that much time while somebody else got paid to do this.
[00:08:36] Myriam: And they can exchange with you and that's like that's the whole value of a community And I I know there's like a lot and a lot and a lot of communities out there Finding the right one where people have the same objective as you that's a bit harder, right? So I think that this is one of the things I love about what You're putting together so that we can level up at our own speed and we don't have to be ashamed or be like, Oh, I don't know this.
[00:09:08] Myriam: And there's something wrong with me. No, like both of us were senior. We're both like, Oh yeah, the web P thing. Okay. Yeah. We'll get to that at some point. We'll discuss it in a different SEO cashflow, but yeah, I passed the baton to you. I. Please. What's your opinion on this community? How did you choose to build it?
[00:09:28] Olga: So, as I mentioned, there is this SEOfly Pro community I launched previously and together with the course, and now everyone who signs up for the course also gets lifetime access to SEOfly Pro. and SEOfly Pro has this section, which is devoted entirely to course and course topics.
[00:09:49] Olga: And within the course in each module under each video, there is also the comment section. So you can always like ask something. And within the syllabus there is also a SEO audit FAQs section where I invite students to ask questions and I will, answer those questions specifically as videos within that specific module.
[00:10:14] Olga: So there is also this element where people can interact with me, with others, and they can have me shoot videos for them with their specific questions. So that's, the community part of the course.
[00:10:31] Myriam: Well, not only that, but like, for me, what is key and something that I don't find in some other communities is that sometimes you'll go in and you see people asking questions and then there's this, sometimes there will be an answer, but it's not the actual answer on like how to help me to handle my problem.
[00:10:51] Myriam: So there's going to be often like a theoretical, like, Oh yeah, we know this is not enjoyable and it's like caused by this. And it's like. Okay, cool. Thank you for educating me, but I have a job to do. Like I need to handle this, the end. One of the first things that I noticed about you before getting to know you is you handle all of that stuff.
[00:11:13] Myriam: You're like, no, no. No, no, this is how you, this is how you handle this mess. It's not pretty, but here's how you handle it. So there's always, once again, a beginning and an end to this. You don't have to suffer through.
[00:11:27] Olga: Yeah, totally. Totally. So, um,
[00:11:32] Myriam: I, I do have to ask because that, that is one element that I'm really, um, focused on something that I noticed is that there's a lot of folks who are ADHD in marketing, but specifically in SEO, like, yeah, we are over represented.
[00:11:49] Myriam: So, When one of the things I noticed as a trainer, people love my courses because it's dynamic, it's not boring. It, the information is chunked in a way where they can easily process it and like, remember it, but they know they can always go back to it. So what were the pluses when you were structuring all this content?
[00:12:10] Myriam: How did you go about like. structuring it, bringing rigor and going, yep, I know that this is going to be useful for people.
[00:12:20] Olga: Huh. That's a good question. So when I'm interested in something, it is easy for me to talk for an hour about this.
[00:12:26] Olga: And I try to, not to have such long videos in the course. So I made sure that the videos stay between 5 4 minutes to maybe 15 minutes if something is like super complicated and needs a little bit more time. And under each video, there is also a written material, corresponding material for that video and some, maybe some other materials if it makes sense.
[00:12:52] Olga: So people can both watch and read and and those chunks I try to keep them under 15 minutes. So everyone should be able to complete maybe one lesson per day or something like that. So, I
[00:13:10] Myriam: have a trick question for you. When do you look at your training material and go, Hmm, that should maybe be a checklist?
[00:13:20] Olga: Uh huh. I haven't heard.
[00:13:24] Myriam: Yeah. So what, what I want to know is how does your brain work when it comes to content? Like when, when do you go, Hmm, this, this another format would help?
[00:13:36] Olga: To be honest, I simply I think I use my hunch and experience. Because like, 2, 3, 5 years ago, I created like the first version of my methodology checklist, which later evolved and got famous as.
[00:13:51] Olga: And based on that I created a lot of like subtopics and I did a lot of brainstorming in like in an empty Google documents and I had this more or less organized structure before. And I'm simply like taking this lesson. Sitting down, thinking for, for a few moments creating notes and just going with the flow.
[00:14:14] Olga: And my idea is that every lesson is explained in video. And if it makes sense to provide a checklist or anything else, like a PDF download, it is going to be there depending on the topic of the, of the video of the lesson.
[00:14:31] Myriam: I love hearing this because it's one of the things that a lot of SEOs struggle with.
[00:14:36] Myriam: When we go, okay, but I need to remember this. What am I going to do? And then we start like feeling the need to have all of this data and we accumulate and we hoard stuff that we don't necessarily always use either. So what you're doing is making sure no, no, we stay on track. Like we, we go lesson by lesson to go.
[00:14:57] Myriam: I have another trick question for you. I know. So have you ever taken a course before that was just pure SEO to level up in something?
[00:15:10] Olga: I would say when I was just starting out in SEO in like 2010 9, then I took this very huge kind of course. Which, which was like subscription based. It was called SBI Site Build It.
[00:15:26] Olga: It was, it is like super, super long, super detailed, tons of videos, written materials, like your your head could explode. My mind exploded many times. It was very detailed. And this was like, basically the only course I took and it took me many months to complete it because. Together with the course, you will be building a site, but this is basically how I learned SEO fundamentals, how it worked and how I learned, I think, to be so detailed.
[00:15:56] Olga: oriented and at the same time with a Dhd a kind of personality when I am interested in something then I get in this hyper focus mode so I don't have like any issues here with like Getting bored or something like that. So that so that's a huge advantage for me
[00:16:17] Myriam: So I I will say this though You still remember, you're still kind of traumatized going, Oh my God, he was huge.
[00:16:25] Myriam: Oh my God, it took me months. And I love the fact that I see that you learn from this going, no, no, I'm going to make something that is binge watching. Like I can just eat them up and apply them as I go, but that suits more people. You don't have to like break your brain or make your brain explode in order to understand.
[00:16:48] Myriam: What the content of the course is, and I think that this is something that is quote unquote new in the sense that when I first got started, it was the same, it was almost like a cult, you needed to like, your brain needed to just rewire itself to understand this. And I feel like education in terms of SEO has gone a long way.
[00:17:09] Myriam: Because it's no longer this protected and this detail. No, when we're going to give you detail, it's because you need it. We know what is signal. We know what is noise and we're saving you the time.
[00:17:22] Olga: Exactly. So, it took me 10 years or so I am a slow, a slow person in that respect to become an independent, fully, fully independent SEO consultant.
[00:17:34] Olga: And I'm pretty sure this could be achieved in a, in a smaller amount of time had I known a few things, which I know now, that's why with this course, my goal is to save a lot of time. People may, may need to get where I am now. So after completing this course, you will actually have a pretty. Good, foundation of being an SEO auditor and you, if you are really determined to complete everything, you should be able to start selling SEO audits for the prices I sell, which usually starts at 5K.
[00:18:10] Olga: So this is like the biggest goal behind the course, to, to give you those abilities, this mindset, those skills so that you can take them, apply them, and leap over the things that I have been doing and I shouldn't have been doing and all the mistakes.
[00:18:29] Myriam: So I, I know I keep saying it's the last, last, last question, but it truly is the last one for this episode. Tell me, Olga, if you had to convince your boss, even if your boss is yourself, to get this course, what would you tell them?
[00:18:44] Olga: Huh, so I will tell you. That now the pre sale has started.
[00:18:49] Olga: This is my first course and because this is my first course I am happy to lower the price. So I decided that the price for the course should be the price, the starting price for my audit, which is 2. 5k, but this is the first course. This is the pre sale and the course now in the pre sale period costs 750 dollars instead of 5k and the If you buy the course now, you keep that price forever.
[00:19:19] Olga: And even when at some point in the future, the course costs 7k, you will still have access to it and all the upcoming updates. So I think that's a good deal.
[00:19:32] Myriam: It is a very good deal, but I think that if you're going to get this course, you better have your numbers aligned. So if you work in an agency, go to your boss and go, Hey, I am going to be able to create courses that, sorry, audits that are worth this much.
[00:19:49] Myriam: And this for me is very important in terms of investment, where you're like, Hey, if I do one audit a month, This course pays for itself way above and beyond whatever you could find. So I think it's very important to look at it from a ruthless, like I am investing in myself. I'm invested in, Investing in the company and the quality of my deliverables and all of a sudden you'll start looking at the price Differently you're not looking at the hype of who's doing it.
[00:20:18] Myriam: You're not looking at the hype of oh my god. It's a pre launch No, you're looking at how can I make money with this? That's my end goal. I'm investing long term sustainable in myself and my business
[00:20:29] Olga: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I couldn't agree more with what you have said.
[00:20:35] Myriam: Because I remember learning all this stuff.
[00:20:37] Myriam: Even now I invest so much time, so much time, I spend the entire weekend going down a rabbit hole and I know I'm not going to get paid for it. Like, I just invest so much time so I can save other people time. That's great. But at some I gotta start monetizing this.
[00:20:53] Olga: Yeah.
[00:20:55] Myriam: Yep. We all do that. So thank you very much for taking the time to talk to me about this because I really, really care about this type of stuff and I can't wait to see what it's going to feel like, what it's going to look like and hear people talk about it.
[00:21:09] Olga: Yeah, me too. But before we wrap up, can you tell me a few words about your latest project? I heard a word about it. Maybe you could tell me more.
[00:21:21] Myriam: Yeah, I, I'm always focused on other people's stuff, but, um, I recently launched a, an agency called Neuro Spicy Agency, so I am working with my co founder, Stephanie Walter, who's a world renowned UX researcher.
[00:21:35] Myriam: I mean, she's amazing. And for years we've been collaborating with each other going, That should be a sticker. What if we made socks? Oh, we need to actually improve this UX research method because it comes from marketing. Let me tell you a few things are here are some tools we should use and we decided to have something that is a bit unusual.
[00:21:56] Myriam: So if you need to train or manage your diverse teams, so folks that are ADHD, autistic, dyslexic, a few other, um, Types of neurodivergence obviously exist in that umbrella term. I'm just naming one of the few that we encounter quite often at work. And if you want to talk to them in a proper manner, something that gets your results, how do you do it?
[00:22:19] Myriam: Well, we discussed that. If you need to make things that are, you know, a bit more accessible cognitively, like you're not going to market to an engineer. The same way you're going to market to, let's say, a teen who's on TikTok looking at eyeshadows. You're not. And if we're talking about e commerce, it's the same thing.
[00:22:41] Myriam: Well, some of us are just really focused about sensory stuff. Imagine if you could have e commerce filters that were like, Oh yeah, that sweater, no, no, we guarantee it's 100 percent soft and comfortable. Like it doesn't just look soft. We promise it's soft. I shop for makeup that is not sticky to my face. I want that filter.
[00:23:02] Myriam: So that's what we focus on. We're like, Hey, what if we made the world a bit more accessible for people who don't necessarily think like 80 percent of the population could benefit maybe 100 percent of the population. So let's try it.
[00:23:16] Olga: Yeah. I love it. So where can people find, find the, the agency, learn more about it.
[00:23:22] Myriam: Okay, so it's neurospicy. agency and I have an extra thing. I'm lucky because I get to work with Giulio Penazzo as well. I'm pretty sure that you know our neuroscientist turned SEO friend and we're running a study actually so you can head on over to neurospicy. agency and in the blog you'll have a link.
[00:23:46] Myriam: To participate, everyone can participate. You do not need to be neurodivergent. You don't need to be declared. You don't need to, you can be neurotypical as well. What we need is people's, um, experience while shopping for things because we're realizing something Olga. With that study, we have statistically significant data that says, you know, the messy middle that Google talks about?
[00:24:08] Myriam: Oh, it's not that messy, actually, for neurodivergent people, we're focused on a lot of different things.
[00:24:16] Olga: Huh, that's interesting. Okay. Miriam. So I will link to that below. And this is, yeah, this is a fun, a fun project. And I'm keeping fingers crossed for, for you. Any final thoughts?
[00:24:31] Myriam: Well, honestly, I think that we're going to hear more and more about communities developing like yours, because it gets harder and harder to find stuff on Google.
[00:24:42] Myriam: Reddit is full of bots. Facebook is not navigable for me. And people turn to Places that are trustworthy, safe, credible, and provide valuable information. And I think that there's going to be a lot more niche, interest based communities popping up in the next few years.
[00:25:02] Olga: Yeah, I think so too. Yeah, definitely.
[00:25:05] Olga: Okay, Miriam. So, thank you so much for for being here with me and helping me pitch.
[00:25:15] Myriam: Well, it's, it's beyond a pitch. And that's what I really appreciate about this is that there's a, you put a lot of thought, a lot of careful thought, tests, etc. You will iterate up until you have a product that you're proud of and something that actually makes sense to your standards, not something that you can sell fast and easy.
[00:25:36] Myriam: So yeah, of course I want to be talking about this. This is so different than most of the stuff we see on LinkedIn. Like, yeah, for sure. So thank you very much folks for tuning in and we'll see you for the next episode. Yeah. Thank you. Bye
[00:25:51] Olga: bye. Bye.
