Is SEO Dying?
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[00:00:00] Olga: Hi everyone, it's Olga Zarr from SEO Sly. This is SEO podcast by SEO Sly. Today I have two guests, not just one. This is Rafał and Radek. Maybe you can introduce yourself a little bit. They have already been my guests in the past. They are also from Poland and I think they are doing great things in SEO.
[00:00:24] Olga: Not only so, can you briefly tell a word about yourself? SEO done right. I'm Olga Zahr an SEO consultant in SEO since 2012. Don't forget to subscribe to learn SEO for free with me. Now let's get into the show.
[00:00:45] Raf: Sure. Uh, hi everyone. Uh, my name is Raf. Um. I've worked in SEO for so many years, uh, I can't remember how many, um, I'm a co founder of Husky Hamster and non agency.
[00:00:56] Raf: So we do, um, international link building and international and investor, uh, programmatic SEO projects. And we have a Rad, um, with us, co founder as well.
[00:01:09] Rad: Hi Rad. Hey everyone. It's right here. Um, yeah, I, I think I also don't remember how many years I've been in SEO, but it rings about around 14, I think. And, um, yeah, I'm the CTO, uh, the company, and, uh, I'm also at the moment mainly leading the investors projects and overseeing some of the.
[00:01:35] Rad: More difficult SEO campaigns. So the easy ones are for me, for people who can deal with who are cheaper. Let's put it this way.
[00:01:49] Olga: Makes sense. Okay. So, so today I think we want to talk about, A little bit controversial and very popular topic like everyone is talking about right now, which is the apocalypse of SEO, which is coming like SEO is dying and our jobs will probably stop exist very soon.
[00:02:09] Olga: And how do we prepare for that? So we wanted to share our insights on that topic and and offer you how we approach it. some of the tips we have and generally like rant a little bit about that because This is a nice topic to talk about so Rad maybe we can start with you How do you see the SEO apocalypse like what's going on?
[00:02:33] Olga: Like how do we protect ourselves?
[00:02:36] Rad: Well, I'm just hoping it's not going to be a ranting episode where three SEOs met and are just complaining about what's happening in the world. Well, I gotta say, I don't complain that much. Um, although. Or just earlier today, I saw an article on search engine journal, um, with, with title something around, is AI going to take over all SEO work?
[00:03:10] Rad: Yeah. So I think you, as you rightly said, it's a very Uh, popular subject at the moment. I personally don't worry about none of it, uh, because my other, um, love, uh, business wise and career wise is programming. So I think I'm going to be good. Even if AI truly takes over all the SEO work, although who knows, maybe it's gonna take over dev work
[00:03:42] Olga: also.
[00:03:42] Olga: Yeah, this is what I wanted to say. I think developers are the next, like, after SEOs to be taken down by AI. So, so what are you going to do?
[00:03:52] Rad: You know, looking at. At both of these from from at least my experience, I think developers actually have a little bit more to worry about because especially those ones that are Just writing the code because if you look at seo At the broader scale seo is many more things done.
[00:04:15] Rad: Just You know, writing content or churning out pages or doing some, some code like developers do SEO, you know, marketing in general is a lot that involves data analysis and as much as I think machines will be good in data analysis, they will not be that great to. Figure out what data and from what sources pull it, not at least for a little while.
[00:04:42] Rad: Um, at least it's my hope they won't be, maybe let's put it next week for the next week. And the next week we're going to see that, uh, LLMs are now connecting to all the tools and figuring everything out. Uh, no, I think. This is kind of like, as much as we have SEO courses and, and a lot of materials online, some SOPs or some things that we do are based a lot on experience.
[00:05:14] Rad: And it's difficult to teach machines experience where there isn't that much information about that because everyone has their kind of like their own way to go about things. But. Hey, I I just hope i'm not gonna be proven wrong. What do you think rap?
[00:05:34] Olga: Yeah, tell us
[00:05:37] Raf: Right, um,
[00:05:39] Rad: well, that's a difficult one. Um, do we have jobs?
[00:05:42] Rad: No in two years
[00:05:45] Raf: Well,
[00:05:47] Rad: I think you're much more pessimistic than I am. Oh god
[00:05:53] Raf: Right, no, I think to be completely honest, um, I think we're gonna be good. I mean, especially good seos like Because, you know, if, if you, if you know your way around Google, if you know your way around machines and, uh, and, and a bit of code, and then you obviously need to know a lot about marketing, about the digital world altogether, right?
[00:06:15] Raf: And SEO might be dying when you think about it from the very, like, old fashioned, so called perspective. Uh, which is based only on content and whoever has more articles is ranking higher, right? Um, if you think about it that way then yeah, you might probably be jobless soon but if you you've got a little bit more experience or at least willingness to learn a little bit more and you You get it into You know, um, SEO, um, from the perspective of SEO being a marketing channel, a very complex, very sophisticated and very diverse marketing channel, when you need to understand the audience and you need to understand those little things that behind this, uh, then I think you say, I mean,
[00:07:03] Rad: everyone who really, uh,
[00:07:05] Raf: understands, uh, how SEO works, how marketing works and what SEO is for.
[00:07:12] Raf: And it's safe, but if you don't, then it might be a problem because simple SEO optimizations, um, content production, any content. You know, video, whatever, um, images, uh, that that will be replaced and basic optimizations on it will be replaced to, uh, by machines already is, but it's going to be even faster than now because those machines are learning very fast.
[00:07:37] Raf: I mean, it sounds like, you know, a Terminator or something. Um, um, but yeah, machines are taking over. So, uh, brace yourselves. I
[00:07:51] Rad: just, I just wanted to say that regarding basic optimization, I'm not sure if I may have misread it, but I've been looking at the recently changed Google starter guide. For website owners, correct me if I'm wrong, uh, if, if you've seen it, but I think I read something that's where Google said that, well, Optimization, technical optimization isn't as important as it used to be because the algorithm is very well versed in figuring out some small mistakes.
[00:08:28] Rad: So just a normal website owner doesn't really have to worry about it that much. Uh, I don't know if this, this is something I may be misinterpreted, but I think it was, it said something around that. Yeah, I
[00:08:41] Olga: think it was in the section about the silos, creating silos, right? Because I read the updated version and I think they said that it is good to have a good structure, especially if you have a huge site, but you shouldn't like change everything now because Google understands, probably understands well your site.
[00:09:01] Olga: So I'm not sure if this was about that. But with technical SEO, I, I think this is what they meant as long as you make your site crawlable and indexable, right? Which is like kind of, at least now the basis.
[00:09:17] Rad: Yeah. So isn't this. Exactly what, what Rafael said in, in terms of Google being smart enough to figure out those sheer basics.
[00:09:28] Rad: And, you know, we still have to obviously make sure, as you said, Olga, it's scrollable and indexable, and it makes sense for the bot. Uh, but I think, yeah, well, I don't think, I don't think we're going to be out of the job. I think it's just, the job is kind of. Leveling up a little bit and it's going to operate at a slightly higher abstraction layer
[00:09:56] Olga: Yeah, so assuming that the main search engine doesn't change Maybe it will be slightly like different because we will have maybe sge like on a regular basis with every or almost every query we make but assuming this stays the same then I am pretty optimistic That yes, the smart seos will be there.
[00:10:17] Olga: We'll just have to learn new things, observe new things, use AIs in ways to make our work more productive. Because like, even for data analysis, like the thing I did with ChatGPT today, Code Interpreter, analyzing data from GSC and GA took me like, I don't know, it took me 15 minutes maybe. In the past, it took me a couple of hours or even more.
[00:10:41] Olga: So if we know how to leverage those tools to become more productive, this is, this will be, I think, An opportunity even for us to grow as an SEOs to become better. But what if the search engine landscape changes completely and we don't have Google or Google evolves into, I don't know, some AI chat, maybe Bards will be there, just Bards, or we'll only have this chat interface or whatever.
[00:11:12] Olga: What, what we do then if like the search engines in the way we know, know them now are. Gone in, let's say, I don't know, three years, five years, , there will be AI optimization.
[00:11:26] Raf: I dunno, I I know my way around gardening. So I can, I can do garden.
[00:11:32] Rad: I, I could, let's coin another term search. Artificial intelligence optimization.
[00:11:39] Rad: The, the abbreviation is a bit bad, but , yeah.
[00:11:44] Olga: SAIO or A-I-O-I-I heard a IO somewhere . So what do we do then? Like.
[00:11:55] Rad: Well, I, my opinion is that we always adapt. We have adapted since, you know, SEO existed essentially, and Google has seen huge shakedowns in terms of the innovation that algorithm, uh, Not as much in terms of how the whole search interface behaves, but I think in the end, what is it about? It's about ranking something, giving users lists, giving users some diversity in the results.
[00:12:39] Rad: So, you know, if we've been able to figure out SEO for 20 plus years, how to rank in the, you know, the 10 blue links, as it used to be called and still sometimes is, although there's no more 10 blue links on their own. Yeah, it's, it's, we're going to adapt to that somehow. We're going to figure it out. We'll have to.
[00:13:06] Rad: Um, and. Lastly, sorry, I guess I'm taking time for Rafał. Please do. Of course. We have a lot of time. Lastly, essentially, websites need to evolve into being better for the user. And as SEOs, this has been our job for a It's now for at least a few years. And if SEOs, any of your SEOs listening to this, we're focusing on just content links and, you know, some little fixes, then they've been focusing probably on the, on the wrong stuff, uh, cause you got to focus, focus on the user first.
[00:13:44] Rad: And so, you know, there will be always work to optimize stuff. It's just figuring out, it's just about figuring out what and how to optimize it. And
[00:13:55] Olga: Raf, your take?
[00:13:57] Rad: Yeah, my take would
[00:13:58] Raf: be, I don't believe in such a drastic change that will affect in SEOs actually losing the work. Well, mainly because even though that Google changes frequently and quickly, there's always change towards users, right?
[00:14:18] Raf: And If you observe, observe the past, if you analyze the past, this is exactly what was happening. And as Brad said, we were, as SEO is always adjusting and what has happened that SEO is big, became more and more sophisticated with every single update with every single year. And we started charging more for our work because we have to understand more.
[00:14:39] Raf: We have to understand different tools, right? The, the, the spectrum of analysis getting broader and broader. Right. Um, so whatever bar though, whatever Greg or whatever they figure out later. Um, I think, you know, with our expertise. And understanding of digital landscape. Um, I think it's going to be benefit for SEOs, to be honest, really.
[00:15:07] Raf: I really, I can't wait for it. I mean, because I look at SEO from the perspective of like, Hey, this is one of the tools, right? This is one of the tools that we supposed to be using to. You know, I wanted to say to make search better, but no, that's not my job, uh, to, to rank our clients, to make the money or to make money on our own projects.
[00:15:27] Raf: Right. So it might happen that for certain, uh, for certain types, for certain topics, for certain types of websites, SEO, as we understand it today might not be the best and the only option option anymore. Uh, because you have some for mentioned S. G. Uh, right. It could be right, but there are a lot of other things that we can use.
[00:15:48] Raf: Um, and we can put our skills into used to make our clients money or make money for our own projects. So it's a big unknown. Um, in a sense. Yeah. But from the other hand, I don't feel Um, that, you know, that's going to be a major problem, uh, for, for experience experience as years, but I need to mention that obviously if someone is starting in SEO now, and you might not be able to gather a lot of expertise.
[00:16:22] Raf: Uh, quickly. Um, and do not is not able to run a lot of tests. Uh, it might get in a bit of a trouble when Google actually deploys as G and everyone follows and it's going to be a bit of a mess for a while. Right? But so what I would suggest here and I always do when I speak with someone younger. Which is not really difficult because it seems like everyone, everyone's younger now than me, but anyway, uh, To all those youngsters out there Uh, just again think about seo as a tool, right?
[00:16:55] Raf: So this is not about keywords anymore. This is not about single headings Right. Or some scheme optimizations and you're more on a single pages. I mean do all the things but think about it from the perspective of the user again So, you know for if you run the project for a b2b Company, for example, you you need to understand who is behind the query You need to understand their funnel.
[00:17:17] Raf: You need to understand If you're writing or creating content ordering the content, whatever or reorganizing the content even you need to understand To whom this content speaks to right? Whether that person who reads that content, who finds that content, whatever, what is going to click through and, you know, it's going to be a successful lead, right?
[00:17:38] Raf: So it requires a lot more analytical thinking and analyzing competitors and the landscape in general. So you can charge more because you will deliver better results. And AI, as you both said, helps. Right. Because A B testing, for example, on content, right. For specific queries and pages, it was super difficult.
[00:17:57] Raf: They had, you know, even if you wanted like 100 words content or whatever, different images, you had to go through entire process of ordering, paying for it, testing takes ages. Now you can test and replace very quickly because of the AI. And I think that's going to be progressing. You will be able to get generate and create better content.
[00:18:17] Raf: Um, and you can. You know, test your lead generation, for example, a lot, a lot more often to find the best of the best. So we are good, I
[00:18:27] Olga: think. Yeah. Yeah. I like this optimistic approach and I like to believe that this is actually like how it is going to, to be. But, what you talked about is more about when you already have the traffic and what you do next to kind of get the ROI from SEO.
[00:18:49] Olga: I want to talk about this stage of actually getting the traffic and I still believe that SEO fundamentals in many cases, in most cases, because I audit a lot of sites, most sites do not have the SEO fundamentals in place, so they do not even get into this. They don't, they do not even can get a chance to get into this game of what you're talking about.
[00:19:15] Olga: Basic SEO, and I think in this document, recently updated, started SEO guide, there was a lot about that and Google was also like talking about some myths. There are, I don't agree with all of the, all of the things that Google said there, but one thing that I always, um, emphasize and wants everyone to do is to have their, their list of all their canonical pages, indexable pages, and map one single like target keyword.
[00:19:50] Olga: I still kind of think in terms of keywords to that page. Of course, this keyword will have a lot of variations, synonyms, blah, blah, blah. But if you have that, and you actually have all the SEO fundamentals tuned for that keyword for on this, every page, then you actually. Can get into the seo game and this is still even though we're talking about ai doing all those magic Magic things with ai those tools that can rank us help us magically surfer seo or not I still believe this is the fundament fundamental thing.
[00:20:24] Olga: That's Lots of SEOs, lots of sites are lacking, like, have you also noticed that? And I still think it works right now, 2024, keyword density, getting the keyword on the page in the right places. At least now it still works, in my opinion. What are your thoughts?
[00:20:45] Raf: Well, mine would be Of course, like, come on, like you need to get basics, right?
[00:20:54] Raf: Um, and this is a starting game of SEO. And I agree that so many sites, whether small or big, they do meet the certain basic elements. So you don't need, as Rod said, you don't need to go crazy about it, you know, optimization, but you need to cover the basics, right? Because Google, in a sense. In the percentage of it, it's still all the same Google, all the same Google that we had a while ago, right?
[00:21:19] Raf: It goes through the links, it analyzes what it finds there, and obviously it's a lot more sophisticated set of algorithms now, but the basics are the basics, and you need to optimize it to get into the game, as you said, Olga. 100 percent on this. Like, um, I can see a lot of sites don't do that, and this is, you know, we can carry on with this.
[00:21:41] Raf: Talking about internal links, right? Um, because some people say, Oh, you don't worry about internal links, like if you have, you know, if the page is not orphaned, then it's going to be alright, right? Someone's going to find it, like Google's going to find it. Well, yeah, maybe. Uh, but from the even user perspective, that's ridiculous.
[00:21:59] Raf: You know, if you have your Pages so, so far away from the core or whatever. I mean, it all makes sense to, if you really think about it, right? It really makes sense to make it good for the user because ultimately you make it in most cases, at least good for Google or for whichever search engine you, we talk about, right?
[00:22:20] Raf: Um, good, clear headings, you know, good, clean title, table of contents. Matching images, actually answering the query in your content, whatever that content would be, that's basics. And, but yeah, basics do work. That's why the audits are still very popular. We supposed to be doing audits regularly to fix those things.
[00:22:42] Raf: Right. So I fully, fully
[00:22:44] Rad: agree. I would say that we must be doing audits regularly. Yeah.
[00:22:54] Rad: Sorry, Rafał, because I, I kind of kicked in, you're, you're okay? Yeah, please do.
[00:22:58] Raf: No worries. Yeah, I, I, yeah, there's a dot on my sentence, so
[00:23:02] Rad: hurry up. Okay. Well, earlier when we've been thinking about SEOs and how to stay up to date and how to, you know, catch up with all this madness related to AI and stuff, I just thought of and wrote down three rules that I would have for SEOs.
[00:23:20] Rad: Okay. First one is, and by the way, it leads to actually answering your question. So bear with me one second. My
[00:23:27] Olga: question was supposed to be, let's everyone, I want everyone to share like three tips, three rules so we can, we can start with you now.
[00:23:36] Rad: Okay. I'll circle back to, to the previous one in terms of the basics still.
[00:23:41] Rad: Okay. The punchline will be that anyway. So just, just bear with me. So my first rule for SEOs would be do not fall behind. Okay, because if you fall behind now, things are moving so quickly. You know, we all should try to stay up to date. I don't mean to over exaggerate on this and, you know, follow all the smallest developments in the new language models or some AI tools and, you know, obsess about it.
[00:24:11] Rad: But just don't become obsolete because when times are moving fast, when technology is moving fast, people tend to, some people tend to get obsolete very quickly. The second rule will be to think about the user and this is, I can't, I just can't stress enough how this, how important that is in terms of what Rafael said earlier, with regards to the content, when you're thinking about the user.
[00:24:37] Rad: You'll usually come up with good content if you're thinking about your target audience, which is in fact the user, you will come up with relevant content. You will most likely also come up with good keywords for that. But this isn't to say that you just need to disregard all keyword research and just don't worry about keywords, which I will come back to in a second also in terms of the keywords.
[00:25:00] Rad: But the third rule is better do something basic. Than not do it before you're overthinking it. Okay, and I think that falls into what you said about basic basics, uh, especially at the beginning that you know, if you're worried about oh, what is What is ai going to think about this or that or what is going to come from sge?
[00:25:23] Rad: I mean the fact Is we have no clue. Uh, I don't think even barish words, which who's who's meant to have some back doors to Google. I don't think he even knows, right. Or maybe he does. I don't know, but I don't think so. And, um, this is like a big secret. No one knows what's going to happen with that. No one knows what's going to happen with Gemini.
[00:25:46] Rad: Uh, no one knows what's going to happen with art. No one, no one really knows what's going to happen with it. So, you know, Stick to the basics that, you know, work. And if that happens, worry about it then. And essentially just as a punchline, I would say that essentially our job as SEOs is, and has always been to improve the website for the users, but also make it easy to crawl and index for search engines.
[00:26:13] Rad: If we wrap these up, we should be good. And what I said earlier about the keywords, I've seen so many SEOs. Um, in some previous companies and, and some friends also, uh, they asked me for a consultation. I sometimes, you know, share my, my time and knowledge with them and I asked them, okay, so can you show me your keyword research or what's your main keyword for that page that you're trying to target?
[00:26:38] Rad: And they don't know because they're thinking too much about the topic itself that they don't even try to select. You know, something as their Northern North Star, which is, I think, personally, it can be okay in some cases, especially when you're targeting easier keywords. But if you're going after some hardcore ones, it's like you got to know what you're working towards.
[00:27:03] Rad: Right. Yeah,
[00:27:04] Olga: totally. Totally. Okay. So I will share my three. Rules for 2024. So the
[00:27:11] Rad: first one, ladies and gentlemen, all good guys are with her three rules for
[00:27:16] Olga: 2024. Yeah, exactly. So the first one is, like I said, make sure the basics are covered and your, your pages are actually tuned for what you want them to, to rank for.
[00:27:29] Olga: The second one would be give this human voice to your, assuming like, let's say I'm talking about my own sites and where I want to SEO my SEO services. I want this to be like a personal, personalized experience. I don't want to be like a faceless person. There has to be this, human element, human person.
[00:27:49] Olga: Someone people can like with whom they can make a connection. So I think this is something that will help a lot of. people websites stand out in the crowd of all those AI fakes. So this branding personality and something similar, like keeping up with what's going on and making sure you actually use all those AI tools to your advantage to make you more productive, better.
[00:28:18] Olga: In SEO. And Raf, your three rules, things for SEO in
[00:28:24] Rad: 2024. Only three? Right, right. He's a man of many words. Apparently I am. Right.
[00:28:36] Raf: You know,
[00:28:38] Rad: I
[00:28:38] Raf: would say plan, do, check, check, act. You need, you need just that, right? And what I'm seeing, when I'm talking to people, whether business owners, SEOs, whoever, they very often do not plan that well.
[00:28:56] Raf: And then just like, going after certain things, as you mentioned about, one of you mentioned about, you know, keyword targeting for individual articles or pages. Things are missing, right? So I think, when you have more resources available, but you have very fierce competitors, and a really shaking landscape, you need to plan very well, right?
[00:29:17] Raf: You plan for shorter, fine, but do it. Like, plan for shorter, but do it, right? Plan, and then do. Just do not overthink it, you know, you don't need to know 17 ai image generation tools to start generating your images, for example, right? Really? Uh, You don't you just need one and that's it, right? You paid five dollars to generate one good enough good enough do plan and do because you know when I said to someone once just plan person said Or I'm going to be planning and three months later, she's still, we're planning that.
[00:29:52] Raf: So no, no, no, just do not overthink it. Right. You know, your plan is not, not good anymore. Cause SEO shifted. So plan do, and then check meaning retrospect, look back, analyze what you've been doing. Right. Analyze the effects. Uh, look at the landscape, look at competitors, look what you achieved, where you are.
[00:30:15] Raf: There are so many different ways to retrospect the way you do things and the results, right? So we need to, you need to do it 100%. Um, and then repeat, act again. Uh, whatever, uh, whatever plan you had, whatever results you achieved, whatever you analyzed, you need to look back and replan it and do it again and again.
[00:30:37] Raf: And I think this is a very agile way of doing things, even that sounds very sophisticated, difficult, maybe, or maybe not. You tell me, but what I'm saying is, uh, you need strategy, you need to act on it, you need to check it. Then you need to redo it again and over and over because this is the only way that you can adjust the very, very, um, moving environment, which is Google organic or whatever, whichever organic service we're talking about.
[00:31:05] Raf: And this is what we follow to be honest. Very good.
[00:31:09] Olga: So we have nine, nine actionable tapes. Yeah. Sorry, right.
[00:31:13] Rad: What did you want to say? I was just going to say, cause you all just said, mentioned earlier that you've got to re audit the site frequently and You know, come back and re audit after a while, and this is exactly, exactly showing that this is all a circular process, you just, you just, I'm not, it's not to say that we're running in circles, but we follow certain procedures that we should.
[00:31:40] Rad: Obviously have strategy for, you know, do analysis, do the re audit, take, um, um, conclusions, act on, do them, like optimize, do whatever, create content, whatever it involves, then retrospect. And just do it all over again. Yeah. I had a question to you, Olga, because you, you mentioned something, um, about living persona and personalized experience for the content on the website.
[00:32:15] Rad: So. Um, I've been working with this, I, I used to work with this marketing department and this is also touching a little bit on what Rafał said, so you had, you have to plan and they've been planning six months later. So we've been talking about rewriting some content and on their landing pages. Uh, and they were so extremely focused on this personalized experience that it all turned into a total shitshow.
[00:32:51] Rad: Pardon my French. But they've been just overthinking it so badly and, like, focusing on all the wrong things. And like you said, Rafael, six months later, we've still been at the same point. And I was like, look guys, we could, uh, we could, uh, stop doing links, uh, cause you got to do something on the side finally.
[00:33:14] Rad: And yeah, I had to dump this consultation client actually, unfortunately, because we couldn't just work things out. What do you think about that?
[00:33:23] Olga: Yeah, I, I had a similar situation like many times, so like, where's the
[00:33:28] Rad: limit? ?
[00:33:29] Olga: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of personalization. Definitely. Like, you have to, like, you can spend some, I don't know, 10, 15, 30% of time like doing that, but at some point you have to say enough, we, we have other things to do.
[00:33:42] Olga: It is similar to design. When I see some people like obsessing, like, this pixel has to be here and they cannot have this site live without. Like that, that stupid effect no one notices and it can slow like the entire process down of launching the site or whatever So this is also like this analysis paralysis obsession type of type of Yeah, so definitely There has to be balance.
[00:34:13] Olga: This is important, but yeah, like with everything, balance.
[00:34:17] Rad: Yeah, be pragmatic about it. Yeah. Because lack of it kills the agility.
[00:34:26] Olga: Yeah, totally, totally. Right. Okay, cool. Yeah. This is like, yeah, a very like good, uh, I would say ending that gives, uh, I hope a lot of people, uh, food for thought. if they are like, uh, if they are prone to doing those things because I know a ton of people can get stuck with, with those things.
[00:34:47] Olga: So hopefully it will maybe let them think more about it. Okay. So any final like thoughts, concluding thoughts in addition to that, like one sentence motto for, for, for listeners.
[00:35:08] Rad: I would say, um, just following up on, on Which you just said, don't obsess about things. There is this saying that goes something similar to better done than perfectly planned.
[00:35:22] Rad: Yeah,
[00:35:23] Olga: 100%.
[00:35:24] Rad: Yeah. And, uh, last sentence. Don't worry about SG because we'll see what it is when it comes out and if,
[00:35:33] Olga: yeah, my will be keep calm and do SEO and rough.
[00:35:40] Raf: Yeah. Just say, you know, be brave, go into things, check, verify, don't be afraid. Or even if you are afraid, like. Do not let fear dominate you, whatever those gurus to say about AI, ML and whatever other acronyms that they have in their portfolio.
[00:35:57] Raf: I don't give a nothing about it really. Just go in, test it, like test it, test it, do it, like do your own thing, right? You're an expert. If you're not expert enough, learn, like buy courses, go in into things. Cause again, what are we thinking? What are we talking about here is just people either do not plan at all.
[00:36:16] Raf: Or they plan too much. So as you said, Olga, balance, right? But yeah, don't be afraid, like, you know, the work is for brave people.
[00:36:25] Olga: Totally get your hands dirty with SEO stuff. Indeed. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So thank you both. This is a very fun episode.
[00:36:35] Rad: Thanks a lot. Thank you very much. Thank
[00:36:38] Olga: you. Thanks everyone. Bye.
