Olga & Aleyda
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[00:00:00] Olga: Hi everyone. It's Olga Zarr from SEO Sly. Today I have a very, a very, I think the most special guest I have ever had. This is Aleida. Aleida, how are you doing?
[00:00:13] Aleyda: Hello, Olga. How are you? It's very excited to see you again.
[00:00:17] Yeah,
[00:00:17] Olga: yeah. I'm, I'm so excited as well. I think you are this kind of guest that doesn't really need any introduction.
[00:00:24] Olga: You are probably the most famous person in SEO. So I will skip the introduction. I am very happy because I thought when we, when we set up this recording initially, I thought I would be just recording. I will, I won't be knowing you in person, but now. Last week, exactly a week ago, uh, I had a chance to meet you in person, uh, on Barbados and it was so much fun.
[00:00:50] Olga: Did you enjoy Barbados?
[00:00:52] Aleyda: Yes, it was a very different, uh, conference, much more laid back, um, with an amazing atmosphere and people also willing to network and share in a different environment. Right. I think that the tropics. Uh, do that to you a hundred percent. So, and it was such an amazing surprise to be able to, to, to see you there.
[00:01:14] Aleyda: One of the highlights of, of the event for me.
[00:01:18] Olga: Yeah, yeah. The same with me. And I totally loved your, your, um, your talk on the second day. So it was awesome. So I will be studying the, uh, the, um, your presentation in detail because like my husband also, he was also there. He also loved your, loved your talk a lot.
[00:01:38] Aleyda: Thank you. I really, really appreciate it. Uh, I mean, it's, it's not, let's say trending topic type of stuff, but I, I. truly believe that this is the base of SEO consulting, right? Like doing things in a way that has actual impact, uh, from an execution standpoint and a revenue standpoint at the end of the day.
[00:01:59] Aleyda: Yeah,
[00:01:59] Olga: totally. And it was packed with so many, so many, so many tips, so many things that it was like, like it could easily be turned into like a six hundred pages book, I think, if you wanted to expand on each thing you, you mentioned there. One day. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I want to get to know in detail your SEO story.
[00:02:22] Olga: So can you tell me how it all started for you? When it started? I learned from you that you, um, because at first I thought, uh, you were from. pain. So maybe if we can start from there. So when you moved to Spain and kind of how it all started in a CEO for you?
[00:02:40] Aleyda: Yes, I am originally from Nicaragua and I moved to Spain in 2006.
[00:02:44] Aleyda: Uh, before coming to Spain, I was a web designer slash front end web developer. And, uh, yes, and that, that was a time. Uh, in which I, I was working actually at a newspaper in the web development department of a newspaper in my country. Indeed. And, and I also design, um, websites for clients at a site. And I had designed also websites before that at, um, at ISPs, like internet service, uh, providers were like.
[00:03:16] Aleyda: Imagine at the time, especially in a small country like Nicaragua, these are, these were the type of companies that, uh, used to design websites or develop websites for clients, right? Two party clients. So it was always a question for me about how do you bring traffic? To this website, because, um, that was always the challenge, right?
[00:03:35] Aleyda: Um, after designing, developing, launching, like what, what else? What next? So I started playing a little bit with, uh, Google ads. I had started also to get, uh, and consult for more commerce type of clients. So eventually I realized, no, I need to learn more about, uh, e commerce, digital marketing, bringing traffic, uh, to, to the websites.
[00:03:59] Aleyda: And I, I subscribe or register, um, to this e commerce master, uh, at the university of Salamanca, which is a university here in Spain, uh, they offer. It's a two years master. They offer the first year, uh, online and the second year in person. So I did that. And, and eventually I moved to Salamanca to study the second year while I was in Salamanca.
[00:04:22] Aleyda: The first thing that I started to do was to apply for jobs. I was able to work as a part time, uh, part time as a student. So I started to apply for jobs. It was a little bit of a challenge because nobody wants to do the, uh, hiring per pay work for a foreign student, of course, uh, but I was lucky enough to, to find a digital marketing agency in Salamanca that was willing to go through the.
[00:04:47] Aleyda: Through the hassle to hire me and, and also to bring me into the SEO world because, um, I didn't know anything about it. It was at that agency when I learned, uh, where I learned everything, right? I can, um, the base of SEO, how, what it was, how it worked because at the beginning I was put in charge and this was my.
[00:05:04] Aleyda: First role at the agency, um, to manage a network of websites that they had. So I was in charge to build the websites, travel and education websites. So I to build a website to develop the content of the websites, to monetize the websites through affiliates, ads, et cetera. And, uh, and as part of this process, I was also taught SEO by the SEO department of the agency that already existed there.
[00:05:29] Aleyda: And, uh, I, I realized like, oh my God, this is. The best way, the scalable, uh, organic way to grow, uh, these websites and any website for that matter, uh, especially at the time, right? Like, and, and, um, and, um, um, I also loved how there was a mix of the activities that I already knew and love, right? So the, the technical aspect as a web developer slash web designer, um, the content aspect from a content, from a marketing standpoint that I wanted to learn more.
[00:05:57] Aleyda: About and that is why I, I came to study, uh, to Salamanca at that point. So it was, it was like a win, win, win for me to start learning more about SEO. And eventually, because I really liked it and, and show, let's say, uh, interest on developing more in SEO specifically, when a team member of the SEO department left the agency, I was given the opportunity to join, uh, and start doing.
[00:06:23] Aleyda: Client work, uh, and providing SEO to, to the clients. A lot of the clients of the agencies were also from international clients, from the travel education, like learn Spanish, learn English in, in the different countries, et cetera. So, so that is why a lot of the work that I started doing. Was, um, in international SEO, because it was a very natural thing for me, uh, to start working in a multilingual type of environment because of the type of clients that the agency had.
[00:06:53] Aleyda: Right. So this pretty much how I joined SEO. And I believe that it was a very natural evolution, right? Even if I were from, I come from a different world, it's also funny too, because, um, as a consultant now, I think that my, my work, uh, and skills is of activities. I'm pretty sure that you see that as a consultant yourself now too.
[00:07:16] Aleyda: Um, I don't only do SEO, SEO, but I need to coordinate and manage activities and tasks with, with clients and also sell myself and sell projects also to influence things. And, uh, coincidentally before, uh, being, um, web developer, web designer. I also did all the jobs while I was studying. I was studying systems engineering, uh, in Nicaragua.
[00:07:40] Aleyda: And at one point I was, uh, uh, uh, IT support. Uh, so I pretty much installed 50 machines with Windows 2000 at the time, uh, migrated them, migrated them from Windows 95 to 2000 into a new domain server, et cetera, et cetera. So I was very used to give support. I was very used to troubleshoot issues. And always put my, the best face to, to the, to the people that I was giving support and, and manage the, the, the challenge.
[00:08:15] Aleyda: Right. And then, uh, after that job, I also try a little bit because I was working for a company that give. gave support to many different companies in Nicaragua. So eventually my boss has realized like, Oh, she's great at support. She has technical knowledge. And, um, she's also very friendly and she knows how to sell stuff.
[00:08:34] Aleyda: So I was given the role of a salesperson. Um, but it was a technical search person. So I gave a lot of. pre sale support, um, of, um, when selling servers or switches, for example, uh, this stuff that the company sold. So I literally, um, at some point I participated that this public, um, um, I don't know how to say exactly the word in English, but, um, list stations of work.
[00:09:05] Aleyda: So I did also The hundreds of pages documenting the features that, uh, the machines that we were selling, how they comply with the rules. And these were very strict type of proposal. So all these skills, crazily enough, even if when you think about it, they look. Completely unconnected, disconnected, right, to each other are eventually when I started and I became independent as an independent SEO consultant, they all became super helpful for me because I was not only knowledgeable in SEO, but I also knew how to give support, how to sell my service, how to manage all of this Coordination stuff.
[00:09:46] Aleyda: So yeah, indeed. So, uh, this is something that I want to mention because, uh, more and more I see SEOs who are SEOs now because they took an SEO course and they, they, they were thought SEO. from scratch, which is amazing, by the way. I mean, I don't think that that is bad. That is amazing to accelerate your career.
[00:10:05] Aleyda: However, I truly believe that if you want to excel as an SEO, you do need, um, as much as possible, these additional skills that will highly, highly facilitate your life because SEO stops being a knowledge problem very quickly, right? Right. Like there's a learning curve and after that learning curve, after a couple of years, You already know what, how it is, right?
[00:10:26] Aleyda: So, and it becomes a, a management problem, execution problem, selling problem, influence problem. And, um, I was lucky enough to have all of these additional skills because of my previous SEO life, uh, or non SEO life, but, uh, it's important that, uh, SEOs realize this so they can complement their skills with.
[00:10:46] Aleyda: Additional courses, additional training, uh, doing other type of work that can highly help them to achieve stuff as SEOs now.
[00:10:56] Olga: Yeah, I totally, I know, I know way better understand kind of how, how is it like the miracle of you, I would say. But, um, talking about the courses, uh, expanding on other skills than SEO, is there something like specific you have in mind you could recommend?
[00:11:15] Aleyda: Yeah, for example, I, I love the, there are more courses now focused on the so called soft skills, which, uh, I believe that the name soft skills are sort of like undermining, right? Because they, they look easy, but they are not. They are like the hardest ones. Um, the SU MBA from, uh, Tom Critchlow. Uh, I don't know if you have seen it.
[00:11:37] Aleyda: So these are. Uh, courses, uh, focus on, uh, this soft skills on how to sell, how to develop business, business skills for SEOs, leadership skills. I'm going to send you the, the link here is one is, uh, executive presence. And the other is the art of client management. Both are fun. Fantastic. Um, I have had the access to them and going through them and I think it's fantastic information that can highly help you and accelerate this, um, this knowledge.
[00:12:07] Aleyda: Then there is this, uh, all the group of. Courses that, um, the,
[00:12:15] Olga: um,
[00:12:16] Aleyda: yeah, that Adam, um, from the SEO spring has put together, uh, to be, to, to become better at SEO execution, to think as a product manager, and I'm going to link here, uh, the, the, the curse and, um, I'm The thing here is that, um, is to, to, to understand and have a little bit of more ownership, like development ownership and understanding of, um, when you do SEO, right?
[00:12:48] Aleyda: That, that, again, for me, it comes very naturally because I was before a web designers and I'm from a web developer. So I have, uh, it's, and it's not necessarily about technical knowledge, right? But it's about understanding how workflows. And from a web development standpoint, web designing standpoint, which I have an understanding because of my background, but it might not come naturally if you're starting from scratch in SEO.
[00:13:12] Aleyda: And I believe that, um, Adam Gant's, um, courses that are here are, are fantastic for that. Um, from product ownership. Project planning, uh, dev and partnership playbook. Also at that time, at one time after I finished, um, university and starting the master, I did a one year or so, uh, project management course too.
[00:13:35] Aleyda: Uh, in Nicaragua, there were some. Uh, some programs, um, along with the Tech of Monterrey University, which is a Mexican university that is pretty well known. So they send, uh, teachers, instructors to Nicaragua to, like, to give this additional advanced skills, let's say, from a management standpoint to especially target to people who had, um, uh, graduated from engineering school.
[00:13:59] Aleyda: as it was my case, to complement the technical knowledge with additional management skills. And, and I took it, right? Um, it was hard because it was, these were night courses. So I worked pretty much during the day and I ended up going to the courses. But, but I was able to learn again, the basics of management, uh, planning, uh, PNLs and the business side of.
[00:14:24] Aleyda: Of, of development, right? So, so this again has come quite handy now with my own company and consultancy. So I highly, highly recommend this course. I mean, if you want to work always as an employee, um. I think that at least having the soft skills is important because you will always need to sell yourself internally within the company, especially if you want to have a leadership role.
[00:14:45] Aleyda: Eventually, um, if you want to work at an agency, also, these skills are important if you want to Work as an independent consultant are even more important, right? Because
[00:14:55] Olga: yeah, they're like critical. I would say. Yeah, totally Yeah, totally totally. Okay. So if I'm counting correctly, you are about 18 years into SEO or so More or less
[00:15:09] Aleyda: I started 2007 Okay.
[00:15:12] Aleyda: So
[00:15:13] Olga: yeah, a long time. Yeah. Awesome. Okay. So can you tell me when did you start your own company? When, when did you decide to go solo? Like at what point in your career you had the confidence to say, okay, now I can do it on
[00:15:28] Aleyda: my own. Yeah. Yeah. This is interesting. Again, I love that you asked this question because I, I do feel that nowadays.
[00:15:35] Aleyda: Especially younger generations of SEOs, they look up and they see all the people with, uh, that are, have the visibility that I have or that you have. And they, they, they, they don't realize how long it takes. Right. And, and the reasons and, and that everything takes a little bit of time to get where it should.
[00:15:52] Aleyda: Right. So context is important here. I became independent in 2014, so seven years already into SEO, uh, almost. Uh, now nine years ago, uh, uh, next year will be 10, uh, finally. Um, but it was because literally after a series of jobs that I had had, uh, both in house and as the agency side. Unfortunately, I went through this bad experiences of not being able to get stuff done, of not getting approvals of, of, um, not being sold the project as it.
[00:16:34] Aleyda: Was really or the role of the, the, the functions that I will, uh, will do eventually, anyway, it was, let's say a challenging time in my career, a hard time in my career. A lot of people think that, Oh, she doesn't have her, her moments, whatever. No, I am here because I have gone through a lot of bad moments that have led me to.
[00:16:53] Aleyda: end up building my own thing, right? I'm pretty sure that if I had kept doing the same thing, applying for different roles, uh, at different companies, looking for other people to give me opportunities of the roles that I will imagine to be perfect for me, I will be still looking. I will, I wouldn't have half of the success that I have at the moment also.
[00:17:19] Aleyda: Um, and so I eventually at that point in my career, it's like, look, Um, whether I have bad luck or whatever, especially also I was still working here in Spain, even if remotely. So that was a little bit of a restriction if I didn't want it to move because also, uh, remote work was not as common at the time.
[00:17:38] Aleyda: Um, so anyway, I ended up deciding, you know, I'm going to stay here. Become independent. I need to take up the ownership of this, of the clients that I work, of the, of the good feet of, of, of the, the type of activities that I, that I do. Um, and I literally took pretty much a year to come up to the same revenue that I was doing as a full time employee.
[00:17:59] Aleyda: It went really fast because at that point I was already lucky to have certain type of visibility. Of course, nowhere as the visibility that I have right now, but I was already. Speaking at conferences internationally. I started speaking at conferences internationally in 2012. So in 2014, I was already two years in.
[00:18:16] Aleyda: Um, I started blogging also like earlier than that time. Um, before I started even speaking, I was already doing webinars, et cetera. So I already had some sort of disability and people knew me and people was already looking for me to hire me for the project. So little by little, I was able to at least.
[00:18:36] Aleyda: Have, um, uh, let's say this, this, uh, visibility base to build upon. So I highly, highly recommend even if you're an employee and you're not thinking of becoming independent and you don't even. It's not something that you even think about. It's never harmful to develop your personal brand, if you're able or something that you're keen to do, right?
[00:18:58] Aleyda: It can only help even if you you you're looking to stay working, um, uh, from from as an employee. It will, it can only help you in the next time that you're applying for a job because the HR team or the hiring manager will look for you and we'll see all of this activity that you have, you can only bring know how, it already sells you, uh, and it's less of a hassle for you to, to sell, and this is the thing, people end up hiring, whether internally or externally.
[00:19:28] Aleyda: People that they trust because that is the challenge in SEO, especially as something relatively still new or complex. They need to trust that you are able to do the job, right? That is the first thing. And just by building upon your visibility and being known that you can share and you have certain type of experience of know how eliminates a good bit of that uncertainty with clients or potential managers, right?
[00:19:54] Aleyda: Or hiring managers. Uh, so I highly, highly advise that. You build this visibility, even if you're not thinking on becoming independent, because it can only be useful whenever you decide to do so. And even if you don't decide, it will still be useful.
[00:20:07] Olga: So, yeah. Yeah, totally. I couldn't, I couldn't agree more and I can quickly share because I, I also started, uh, uh, I, I became independent at the seven and not seventh, uh, at the ninth year of my SEO career.
[00:20:23] Olga: So a little bit later than you did, but it also took me a lot of years until I kind of decided, okay, now it's time because I went through the similar experiences as you. Couldn't really this job was okay, but it like this in that job. I felt I couldn't grow So I decided let's take responsibility and create the job that I want and this is this is what I did And this is what you did and this is what I encourage Other women and not women men to do to try doing as well in my case It was, I needed 60 days to match up, match up the income I, I had in my job.
[00:21:02] Olga: So I was ready for a year, maybe two years. But it kind of happened in within 60 days, so
[00:21:08] it
[00:21:09] Aleyda: is amazing to hear.
[00:21:10] Olga: So it was, it was quite quite okay. And I hope it motivates someone to also pursue this.
[00:21:17] Aleyda: What I will highly advise is that if people are actually looking into this, just Like, of course, um, being responsible, you should at least have a few months of savings, uh, just in case when you do the job, because you know, and what I will highly, highly recommend is to at least for one year to start, um, sharing around in the industry, uh, you know, how, uh, whether in blogs and webinars.
[00:21:43] Aleyda: In a virtual or in person events, networking also helps a lot, even if you're not speaking, right? If that is not something that you enjoy to do, no worries, but at least get yourself out there because it will be much easier that someone refers you. Organically, right? Like whenever they understand that you're available for work, that they will, uh, refer to someone and this is only natural, right?
[00:22:06] Aleyda: You refer to someone that you trust, that you like, that you already know much more easily than others for a job. 100%.
[00:22:12] Olga: Yeah, totally, totally. And at first, before I started, I started blogging, sharing around. 2020 I think during the pandemic and before that I was completely unknown. I was doing everything like behind the scenes and when I started and I was thinking about going solo.
[00:22:29] Olga: What I. I didn't really know how to do it, I was thinking how I, how I would sell this, how I would do it, I didn't, didn't have any plan, but when I started sharing, so many opportunities, so many people appeared, and it was basically because of the fact that I started sharing, writing, participating in online community, that I was also like able to finally go solo, without that, I don't think it would be possible to do it that quickly.
[00:22:58] Olga: Okay, I have a question. Like, uh, how big is your company right now? Is it just you or are there like 50 people behind you?
[00:23:09] Aleyda: Yeah, I, uh, I am small by design and this is another thing, right? Um, that I would like to share about. There are many ways to grow. I think that a lot of people and one of the things that they, they, they think and they are afraid is like, okay, if I go independent, the way to grow eventually is to build a big agency as a consultant or a big company.
[00:23:29] Aleyda: And I don't want to be. I don't want to be a manager. I, I, I'm not a business owner and I dislike the side of the, the, the hassle, right, of operating a business. I like to keep consulting for clients and I enjoy doing SEO and this is the. type of role that I designed for myself to do. I have a couple of people, uh, helping me, uh, doing the legwork, uh, that work with me.
[00:23:55] Aleyda: Um, and, and then also another person helping with the operations of, of, of the company. Uh, but it's pretty much myself handling the work with my clients. My clients understand this, and this is what the reason why they actually hire me. Versus any other agency. They want to work with me. They want to bring someone who will be able to go deep in whatever challenge they have right now.
[00:24:21] Aleyda: Many of my clients are actually two type of clients. Most of them are enterprise. clients, they have e houses, your teams, uh, and they hire me because they are so focused on the day to day, um, operations and, and executions that whatever new projects or challenges they have, they, they, they cannot allocate resources.
[00:24:42] Aleyda: So they want to bring someone like me to help them to tackle that. Challenge, uh, or particular process or project. And, uh, unfortunately, many agencies, uh, the people who they have handling projects are not necessarily the most savvy or experienced person because they are the SEO director who organizing everything, not necessarily working with a client day to day.
[00:25:06] Aleyda: They have many times even executive for that, who have like. One year and, and, uh, of experience, years of experience. So, um, it is much more harder to rely completely on a very complex project or challenging projects. Uh, so they bring me for them. I know how, for my experience, and that is what I give, uh, and, uh, completely personalized consulting.
[00:25:29] Aleyda: Um, I work with a number of clients, uh, at a time and the way that I have done to grow. Let's say, uh, my, my consultancy is, uh, growing the type of clients that I work with. Uh, as I mentioned, one hand enterprise level clients on the other hand, and it's startups, uh, well invested, uh, startups, uh, uh, to help them set their SEO program and the base of, of the SEOs, um, operations and, um, and, and, and yes, That on one hand, um, so I can charge more because my work is more complex, uh, projects are bigger and, and it's only a handful of clients.
[00:26:12] Aleyda: Then although the hand I have also, um, SEO FOMO, uh, and my products, I have also another website, remoters on the side with another SEO friend of mine. Uh, so the beauty of. Keeping things small, let's say, and in size, um, is that it gives me the flexibility to run and test and, and, uh, do a lot of this type of additional projects, which I have to say, if it wasn't for that, and it was always only client work, potentially I will have like become, um, bored, uh, because something that you own ownership of your own products.
[00:26:53] Aleyda: Right. So that is why I started. Uh, also SEOfomo and SEOfomo became very, very quickly, very profitable. I believe that SEOfomo is crazy to think, right? Like by sending four emails, um, per month, it makes already more money than I was doing as a full time employee in house years ago, my last, my last job.
[00:27:16] Aleyda: Working, uh, full time. So, so, so I have
[00:27:20] Olga: the same. Yeah, even though my newsletter is way smaller. Yeah,
[00:27:24] Aleyda: that's crazy. That is amazing, right? So, um, so I'm very excited about that is already 30k, uh, subscribers and I have a lot of. of plans for it, stay tuned, uh, to build upon the SEO FOMO brand. Um, and then of course I have marketing FOMO.
[00:27:42] Aleyda: I have Crawling Mondays. Um, I have learning SEO, which is the project that I use to give back to the community, uh, to share reliable. SEO resources for free. And, and also the accelerator in which we go through the most common questions, uh, from people learning SEO, uh, with reliable specialists from each area completely for free too.
[00:28:06] Aleyda: Uh, so that is the project that, you know, it has a lot of my, my, my heart, because it's, it's something that I wish I. Who have had when I started right and it's my way to give back to not to eliminate the burden at the beginning and to give access to everybody independently of where they are located and the capacity to invest in courses that many times are also very expensive to um, so, so yeah, so I am able to do it.
[00:28:31] Aleyda: And to do all of this at the same time, I have the flexibility because of the model that I have, that I have designed for myself, right? If I had been the typical agency owner with 50 people, whatever, going into the operations of how I keep more clients, clients coming every single month, just to be able to keep up with salaries and operations can cost.
[00:28:52] Aleyda: I will have hated it. It's
[00:28:54] Olga: not me. I totally, totally, I'm totally the same.
[00:28:57] Aleyda: Don't, don't be afraid to build up your own path of what you create, uh, of who, based on what you, you, you like, of who you are, your, your strength. And, and, uh, interest to, um, the agency path is not the only way the tool typical tool path is not the only way to, because I, I see a lot of people building SAS, which by any means I love because these are tools that I can use, but I can also see how.
[00:29:25] Aleyda: I need something else, something different because I'm, I'm, we are all unique, right? So I, I love the path that I have, although I'm very proud and very happy. I'm very excited, especially with this projects SEO, formal learning SEO, because of how the impact on when, uh, and then the opportunity that it has open up, uh, for a new different type of products, um, in the format of a newsletter in, in the, in the other
[00:29:49] Olga: case.
[00:29:50] Olga: Yeah, totally, totally. This is awesome, like so many things. And talking about your newsletter, SEO FOMO, so when did you start it?
[00:30:00] Aleyda: I started actually, um, as in, in 2022, uh, so, you know, just, yeah, yeah. So just for context here, just for context, uh, every year I try to try something new, something different. So in 2019, it was scrolling Mondays that I started.
[00:30:19] Aleyda: Um, and I, I started it also to give me a way, a platform to test SEO for YouTube, SEO for video and see how it was there. I started to grow and, um, call it Monday.
[00:30:34] Olga: What are your insights? Yeah, sorry to interrupt. Sorry to interrupt. I just wanted to ask what are your insights about SEO for video in this, from this, from this project?
[00:30:45] Olga: In
[00:30:45] Aleyda: YouTube, in YouTube is more about conversion optimization honestly and community management that are actual, that actual SEO within the platform because, um, most of the traffic of videos in YouTube. rely not in first time searches or one time searches, as people do in Google, but on suggestions of your video within the platform, based on interest matching, topical relevance matching, and, um, and then your subscribers.
[00:31:15] Aleyda: Behaviors. If, if, uh, or your user's behavior, sorry, if the user has subscribed, if they, if the user has, uh, ended up like watching the full thing. So they are recommended more videos from your channel or everywhere. Uh, not only in, in, in that same screen, uh, et cetera, et cetera. So, um, yeah, there, there's a role in the, uh, retention, the engagement, the relevance of, of the video, uh, that you should analyze very well in order to.
[00:31:43] Aleyda: To let's say maximize and, um, and the way that you focus the, the, the video is also important. So that is why, for example, many times in the past, I have published a video on Sundays, right before I send SEO FOMO and I include the link in SEO FOMO. So people who will go and watch the video will go like right after I publish the video.
[00:32:02] Aleyda: So there's a lot of signals of engagement right away. And, and then based on that engagement, YouTube will see that the, the, the, the video. It's very popular very quickly and they will continue, uh, the flywheel of recommending the video much more to look alike called incess, right? So, yeah, so it's, as you can see, it's more of like an engagement community conversion optimization rather than purely SEO.
[00:32:25] Aleyda: Of course you should optimize the title, the description, the hashtags, tags, et cetera, but there's only so much I think that you can do with. the SEO fundamentals and much more on this type of engagement. And, um, and, um, let's say community management side of things.
[00:32:45] Olga: Yeah, totally. Totally. So coming back to newsletter, I got you off track.
[00:32:51] Olga: And so many subscribers.
[00:32:53] Aleyda: Yeah. And then, and then I decided, okay, when I started to grow Crawling Mondays, and so how challenging it was, I was like, okay, how I can own my audience. To send to the videos because I want to send to the videos. One of the typical tips that you see around is like, Oh, do you have a community?
[00:33:11] Aleyda: You send the link to the video and, and to increase the engagement right away. I think like that. Right. So I was like, okay, it's true that I have a good. Um, social follower following. And then that was true back then too. But the reality is that these are following that you don't, you don't own. These are following that, um.
[00:33:30] Aleyda: attention span is very, very small. Uh, you teach something, you share something in LinkedIn. It's like, uh, one second to engage her, right? So it's not something that you own necessarily or control a lot. So I, I decided to retake my newsletter because, uh, I saw that was the other. Area that I hadn't tried, that I hadn't tested, that I saw a lot of information of people how saying how valuable it was to own your, a agency to build a sort of community without calling it a community.
[00:34:01] Aleyda: Right. Or the hasling of, of coordinating or on the radio community. Uh, so I started to create the, the newsletter as a, as a test for that year. That, that year. And, um. It become very, the growth, the growth was amazing very quickly. Um, I, it's true that I did start it from scratch, by the way. I started with 1, 700 or 1, 600 followers, uh, subscribers that I already had from my newsletter, from my, from my website, because many, many years ago, it was in 2015 or so that I had some, uh, when I redesigned my website, I had, I had some newsletter, um.
[00:34:41] Aleyda: Registration options. So whenever, yeah. So whenever I had a tip or a new article, I will send it to you, but yeah, I didn't use it often, let's say, but only that. Organically had built already 1600, 1700 subscribers. So when I, when I wanted to start SEO FOMO, I sent an email to the people who had subscribes at the time say, Hey, I'm rebranding this to SEO FOMO.
[00:35:04] Aleyda: The format will be different. Will be a weekly news like format with the latest in the industry. Um. Let me know if you want to get in, et cetera. And I will start the next week. And, and this is how I started, right? And, um, and it quickly grew. Uh, I also had set certain goals, and I, I'm sharing this for you to understand that things don't only, not only not always go, uh, as you expect, right?
[00:35:32] Aleyda: So at the beginning, the newsletter was growing like, uh, a thousand subscribers per month, right? So I was like, okay, this is great. Um. I want to finish the first year with, uh, 20, 000 subscribers. Right. And, uh, when June came, it became very evident for me that even if I was like already doing certain promotions, giveaways.
[00:35:56] Aleyda: was not happening. So at some time I also started with the, uh, loyalty program, the referral program, if you refer subscribers, you got access goodies as your goodies, et cetera. So, so this is how I started playing around and see how I can evolve more the, the newsletter, right? Like right now the newsletter just reach, um, the 30, 000 subscribers a bit ago.
[00:36:20] Aleyda: And, uh, the next thing that I want to, thank you. Thank you very much. The next thing is that I want to try with a newsletter again, just for you to see. I see that a lot of people are starting paid newsletters, which is amazing. And I love like, like pivots, like an additional newsletter that I will send besides the free one adding more or featuring more insights or whatever, than the one that I send usually, or to compliment with additional insights, which by all means amazing.
[00:36:46] Aleyda: If that is your thing, I want to do something that. Also allows me to grow faster. Um, and I can definitely see how the pay newsletter can allow you to monetize faster, not to grow, but thankfully I'm doing very well, uh, from a monetization standpoint, so I don't need to incentivize that point, but I want to incentivize more the growth, right?
[00:37:07] Aleyda: The scale of the growth of that, of that letter. And that is why I'm going to launch something soon. I said, uh, Hopefully at the beginning of next year of 2024, uh, that will complement the newsletter very well. Uh, that will be something completely free too. So I, as you can see, I'm always testing new things, validating ideas.
[00:37:26] Aleyda: Some of them, uh, are more successful than others and grow in different ways than others. But, uh, the, the newsletter potential is the one that has surprised me the most. And, and, uh, very, very thankful because also, uh, a lot of people send me completely. Um, emails in a spontaneous way telling me, Oh, I like that.
[00:37:48] Aleyda: Thank you very much. This is something that I read every week is how I keep up. And I have tried to develop more than newsletter in a way that is still the, the, the, the, the ratio of the quality is high. Uh, I don't include everything that I am saying or I see around on one hand, then to complement with additional things that I believe that can be very valuable for, for SEOs to keep up, SEO events, whether online or in person, SEO jobs too, um, free SEO tools, especially your freemium ones to take a look at.
[00:38:19] Aleyda: Uh, so I try to complement not only making use focus or typical resource or guides focus, but to complement it with things that help us in our day to day.
[00:38:30] Olga: Yeah. Okay. And how long does it take you to write one issue and kind of gather all the data?
[00:38:37] Aleyda: Yeah. So the data gathering is actually very natural because whenever I, uh, see something that takes my attention in LinkedIn and Twitter or in any groups that I belong to, I save it in a Google Doc.
[00:38:52] Aleyda: So I know that when Saturday is rich, I will have at least 10 resources, the very least. I also have, uh, someone help me, uh, who I have hired to help me to write the first blurb. So I can then on Sunday go and revise the blurbs and edit them out rather than starting from scratch. Um, so this is something that I do.
[00:39:16] Aleyda: Uh, and then I. Use tools like Guzumo to look into any additional articles that are not yet there, uh, that have been written in the last week that have become popular, uh, to add them also in the newsletter. So I do this, all of this, let's say, uh, yeah, work of, of, uh, curation, uh, to, that is a little bit more manual rather than the more like automatic one on a day to day basis.
[00:39:43] Aleyda: Uh, and I believe that the whole process takes me around. Five hours, six hours maximum, but yes, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's not automatic. It's, it's, there's work, uh,
[00:39:58] Olga: totally, totally. And maybe one more thing, two more things. Can you tell me more about learning, uh, SEO, this project, like, like you started this to give, uh, back to community, community and how often, how much do you work on this, like how long did it take you to build the site, how many visitors it has, like whatever you can share.
[00:40:19] Aleyda: Yes, of course. So this was another thing that I started in 2020 because, uh, I believe it was 2020. Yeah, I, I have to say something right? Like with the pandemic and everything that years are blur in my mind. 2020, 2021, they all look like. The same, uh, at some point. Yeah. , uh, but in any case, uh,
[00:40:41] Olga: learn. SEO You're number one.
[00:40:43] Aleyda: Sorry, I didn't learning. Yeah, so sorry. It was 2020 first, actually. 2021, uh, in February, not in 2020. So I started, uh, the website as a way to compile. Good SEO resources, um, in a single place in a way that it's organized in, um, it's organized in a way that facilitate the learning process rather than having.
[00:41:13] Aleyda: Many guides and, and, um, in a way that are disorganized or does really make sense from a learning process. So you don't start learning, learning technical SEO before learning about how search works. Yeah. Right. So I wanted to organize the, the resources in a way that. They really helped someone who was starting the learning journey, or someone who wanted to go deep in certain areas of SEOs whenever they already understood the basics.
[00:41:45] Aleyda: So I, I started by pretty much sharing a Google sheet at the time. It, it grew very like. Uh, like, uh, from, uh, through many iterations, uh, and it was a process that it started like a very basic MVP. Right. And eventually I started to add more and more and more. Um, I created a website myself. Uh, from scratch with different areas, et cetera.
[00:42:12] Aleyda: But yeah, it was not the best looking websites. My, my skills as a web designer slash a front end web developer have been gone since a while ago. So eventually I realized that I, I need to help with that. So I hire, uh, the agency, the web development, um, design agency of a good, uh, friend, uh, who's also an SEO, uh, basically here in Spain.
[00:42:37] Aleyda: Um, and they, they, they did an amazing job with my vision cause I, yeah, I share a few insights with them about what, what I wanted, uh, which have given me a base to build upon, um, because what I also wanted to do for a while, um, was to not only. Create this resources or aggregate these resources for others to consume easily reliable resources, but at the end of the day, these are resources that you need to go through and many times will necessarily tackle the particular question or challenge that you have about about that topic.
[00:43:13] Aleyda: Right? And many times these are. Questions and challenges that a lot of people share because are very common to have when you're learning SEO or that particular topic in SEO. So to tackle that, I started the learning SEO, um, accelerator program, uh, where I chose, uh, 15 people, uh, from all over the world.
[00:43:34] Aleyda: And a lot of these people I love is. They're only one or two base in Europe, right? They are from all over. They are from areas where they wouldn't have had the chance to learn SEO easily because there are not that many companies or agencies, where a lot of people in Europe or in the U. S. will tend to learn more.
[00:43:56] Aleyda: To have the access to this type of roles. So these are people who are coming from countries who don't have that type of access to have this trusted, uh, let's say support, uh, in the, in the rest of your journey. So it's great because they have a lot of the questions that I want to answer for the audience.
[00:44:16] Aleyda: So what we do is to do this pretty much weekly or biweekly sessions going through every. Area of the roadmap, uh, SEO fundamentals, technical SEO, content optimization, lane building, uh, how to develop an SEO audit, um, SEO coordination, um, SEO reporting, uh, setting SEO goals. Setting an SEO strategy. We did one about WordPress SEO, um, a few weeks ago.
[00:44:45] Aleyda: Today, actually we have the Wix SEO one and early next week, uh, it will, will be about Shopify SEO. So we go through every area of the roadmap and we have already covered like 13 topics or so. Um, answering the questions. The main questions about each area, tackling the common doubts, um, of the participants who have been chosen around the world.
[00:45:09] Aleyda: And then also, publishing these videos, recording on a YouTube channel that I have created for it, and also embedding these videos on the website itself. So, whenever who lands on the technical SEO section, they can only have access to the resources. But also tips that I have asked around the community, uh, to get people learning about that particular topic that I have also included their, uh, FAQs that I have created myself, uh, and also additionally, the video, the video, the embedded video going through.
[00:45:44] Aleyda: the questions were in an hour that we asked, uh, people, uh, or SEOs who are highly specialized in that topic. So I, I am the host, I introduce a topic, but, and I, and then I go through the questions that the participant have left. So I truly believe that these areas of learning SEO become like quite satisfying, let's say, in the goal of learning that particular topic, because you have a lot of this different bits, uh, of information.
[00:46:12] Aleyda: Um, not only external resources, but also tips, FAQs, uh, the video that you can watch, uh, that can highly, highly, highly clarify the doubts that you will have. And all this for free in a reliable way. Um, and hopefully this will highly, highly facilitate the, the curve that many people have when starting in SEO or in any particular area in within SEO.
[00:46:37] Olga: This is amazing. Yeah, I now understand why you rank number one for Learn SEO above Google, above Moz, SEMrush. You are just number one. Yeah,
[00:46:46] Aleyda: I am there. I am there. I'm trying. I, I, I am not yet number one. I am number third. You are number
[00:46:52] Olga: one. On my side, you are number one.
[00:46:55] Aleyda: Yes, in Europe, in Europe, not in the US.
[00:46:58] Aleyda: Yes, but not in the U. S. yet. I guess because the other websites are U. S. based and more focused and have more popularity signals coming from the U. S. So please go ahead, especially if you're U. S. based, go on, link back to learningseo.
[00:47:13] Olga: io. Yeah, and click that. Third or second
[00:47:17] Aleyda: search and search and click. Not now that we have the confirmation about clicking behavior.
[00:47:21] Aleyda: Yeah,
[00:47:22] Olga: totally. And maybe, uh, one more word about remorters. So if someone's looking for an SEO job, this is the place to, to look for offers. I remember there are quite a lot of offers that are right,
[00:47:34] Aleyda: right. Yeah, indeed. So I include SEO jobs of every type, um, in SEO FOMO. And other, and other remote. But yes, in remoters, we have remote jobs of SEOs, content marketing, product marketing, like whatever type of remote, uh, role.
[00:47:55] Aleyda: We have a job board for that in, in remoters. And we also have guides and tips of how to work remotely, how to succeed remotely, digital nomading, et cetera. So I highly, highly advise if, if you want to learn about that, or you want to have. Uh, more opportunities, remote opportunities from every area go, you can subscribe also to the jobs alerts there.
[00:48:16] Olga: Awesome. Awesome. So one final, a bit personal question, like how many hours per day do you work? Do you work over weekends? Like how do you manage to do all of that? Like how many hours per client? How many hours? For those other projects, like more or less, if you can estimate.
[00:48:34] Aleyda: Yeah. It's very difficult for me to estimate because honestly, and this can sound a little bit cheesy, but.
[00:48:43] Aleyda: I'm having fun. So I don't, I don't necessarily track or consider this job, right? Like, so for example, and also I'm very flexible with my schedule and that is the beauty of, of, uh, being self employed, right? So literally I, like this call with you is my first, I was sitting on my desk. Uh, before I was, uh, jump roping.
[00:49:05] Aleyda: I like to jump rope as a, as an exercise. Uh, and I was taking coffee and answering emails. Uh, so I was, guess I was working, but didn't feel like a work because I watched, I was watching the news while I was following up with emails. So I take it to easily in the morning. I work much more in the, uh, much more focused in the afternoon because also I have a, a lot of the clients, uh, calls that I have are at the end of the day, because many of them are us based.
[00:49:29] Aleyda: Um, So they are in the afternoon. Um, but, but yes, it, it's very difficult for me to say, Oh, I look, I look at this time for clients, this time for projects. Um, thankfully it all comes. Quite like naturally, uh, from, and I don't need to say, Oh, I cannot keep up. Right. But yes, I, I, I, I'm not going to, to lie and say that I, I, I don't work a lot.
[00:49:55] Aleyda: I, I do. Right. But again, I believe that this is because of how I was raised and how I am. Everybody's different. Right. So I, I literally, since I was in my second year. Of university, I work full time as a, as a web designer. This is when I started to work as a web designer from 30 PM. And then I used to go to the university from 6 to 9 PM.
[00:50:22] Aleyda: Don't ask me how I did it, but I graduated as a systems engineer doing this. And then I don't, don't ask me how, but I did have time to party. I did have time to go out and go to the, watch the movies and have friends and everything. So. Don't ask me how, but I made it happen and so it all happened. So, so I am very used since very young to have this sort of like work hard, um, play hard, uh, mentality, uh, especially like because of my bringing us in a, I think that this is much more common when you come from a developing country, right?
[00:50:59] Aleyda: Uh, since very early, when I was very young, my. My dad always was like, you need to give it all you need to have the best grades and not for the sake of best grades, but because if you want to have opportunities, they, they are not going to look into the people who are have bad grades, right. So that's the reality of it.
[00:51:17] Aleyda: And, um, so that was the mindset that I always had of giving it all. Giving your best, not being, uh, the mediocrity was not an option for you. You need to really try it. If you get it, great. If you don't get it, then, um, at least you give it all, right? So you don't, you don't have that into you. So, so yeah, so this is something that I have, I have applied, uh, that type of work ethic through all my whole life, right?
[00:51:44] Aleyda: So now when people ask me, it's like, how do you do it? It's like, it's like, Well, it feels just my day to day, like, because it has been always a natural thing for me to do. Uh, in my life. Right. So, yeah, there's
[00:51:57] Olga: that. Okay. Awesome. Awesome. So Aleda, so the best place to follow you is of course, to subscribe to your newsletter and where is the best place to reach you?
[00:52:06] Olga: Um,
[00:52:07] Aleyda: well, um, of course, newsletter, seofomo. co. co, um, Also, I am in Twitter still, or Exo, however it's called these days, at Aleda. I'm also in LinkedIn sharing more because of all of what is happening next. I am sharing more in LinkedIn too. Uh, I am, look for me, Aleda Solis there. Um, and then I, my website, aledasolis.
[00:52:34] Aleyda: com. Uh, my consultancy website is oriente. com. I also have Marketing FOMO, which is a weekly newsletter that, um, Let's say shares. whatever is relevant in marketing or digital marketing that is not sharing SEO FOMO. So then none, then non SEO, digital marketing news and resources are there as a pivot to just, again, something, another, another test that I'm doing something that I am also excited about, um, as a complimentary thing.
[00:53:03] Aleyda: Uh, but yeah, so I guess that you can find me through all of this or look, look in Google for Aleida and I tend to run. First for my name. Uh, that is, that is the advantage of that. Your name is not so common. So yeah.
[00:53:16] Olga: Oh, awesome. Awesome. Awesome. I like that. So thank you so much. I am truly honored to have you here.
[00:53:22] Olga: This was such an insightful conversation. Yeah. I will probably be re watching it a couple of times to, to get more, to absorb more. Thanks a ton for being here. And I am so happy that I could meet you in person.
[00:53:37] Aleyda: Yes, likewise. Thank you for the opportunity and we're looking forward to see you at many more conferences.
[00:53:42] Aleyda: I would love to see you speak very soon.
[00:53:45] Olga: I will finally maybe make it. I will try. Yeah, soon. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much. And thanks everyone. Bye bye. Thank
[00:53:55] Aleyda: you. Bye.
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